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The Minute After: Michigan State

by in The Minute After | February 16th, 2010

FINAL SCORE: 72-58 | Box score

We feeling better out there, guys?

Sure, IU got murdered this evening. But all the worries about this team in recent days, that they were lacking effort and hustle and heart and resolve wasn’t the case tonight. They took some charges. When absolutely everything was going Michigan State’s way, they found a way to stay in the game with an almost perfect night at the free-throw line. They trapped and defended their tails off in the final minutes of the game when a win was far out of reach.

They looked more like the scrappy, hard-working underdogs tonight than the team that wasn’t even showing up.

That being said, this evening was a rough one.

IU’s lack of size was exploited time and again. The Spartans pumped in the points inside — 40 of their 72 points came in the paint — and stymied the Hoosiers around the basket on the offensive end — IU only had eight points in the paint this evening, and that was a large reason why they shot so poorly — 34.9 percent — tonight; unless you are hot, hot, hot from the outside, it’s tough to shoot a high-percentage if you’re not also getting some bunnies in the paint. IU did win the rebounding battle tonight, as they snatched 30 (17 offensive) to the Spartans’  24 (11 offensive). But the Hoosiers are a solid offensive rebounding team to begin with, and when you miss so many shots, those offensive-rebounding opportunities present themselves more often.

And in the second half, the Hoosiers had a hard time defending in the pick-and-pop game, as Kalin Lucas seemed to score at will off of high-post screens. Michigan State simply has more talent and experience at every position on the floor and took care of business on the road. This is what good teams do. Steve Lavin talked about this potentially being a trap game for the Spartans tonight, but that wasn’t the case, as they shot a ridiculous 59.3 percent from the floor — a season high.

IU also had one of their typical scoring droughts tonight, but it was — I think — the most extreme of the season: they went the final 10:16 without a bucket in the first half, and it took until the 17:01 mark in the second half until they finally hit one — a layup by Christian Watford. Total that up and it’s 13:15 of not putting the ball in the hole. We talk about low margin for error all the time with this team, but it reared its ugly head again tonight: you just can’t have a lapse like that against a team as skilled and experienced as Michigan State is and expect to have much of a fighting chance. The Hoosiers also only had a measly five assists to 16 turnovers, turnovers that led to 23 points for the Spartans.

But you know what? IU wasn’t really out of this game until late in the second half, and it’s because they shot a terrific 89.3 percent from the foul line, knocking down 25-of-28 attempts. Remember when this team couldn’t hit a free throw to save its life? When they didn’t score those last 10 minutes of the first half, they hit 13 free throws during that time frame instead. For the game, they dominated on the line, as Michigan State only had 10 attempts.

It’s a bit of an outlier, because Michigan State is usually pretty good at defensive free-throw rate. They entered tonight’s contest holding opponents to 27.6 percent on FTA/FGA, good for 13th in the country. Yet,  IU is also 80th in the country at getting to the line with a free-throw rate of 41.8 percent, so they deserve some credit for winning the free-throw battle tonight.

It’s another loss — IU’s seven straight.

But it’s a loss we can all feel better about. And for this moment in IU’s slow and steady climb to relevancy, I’ll take it.

BONUS FUN:

Maurice Creek got credited with a rebound tonight:

Thanks to reader VP for the e-mail on that.

  • Strummer

    Do not understand the three guard offense. It is not working with Rivers down low. it is becoming very clear why he is no longer at Georgetown. Elston continues to play a couple of minutes and back to the bench, he has absolutely no confidence. I love IU basketball, and really like coach Crean, but after awhile when it’s not working you should really look at some other options. Are there still rumors of Elston leaving? We could recruit three or four more guards. Future looks bleak, but will continue to be an IU fan. Just ready for a different approach. No expert here, just a tired fan!

  • TheJake4Three

    ya it feels real good when the team you root for gives an all out effort – but still can’t dream of winning the game. contrary to what the fairweather fans want to say about “staying close”, this team never had a snowball’s chance in hell of winning this game tonight. they were completely outclassed athletically, and without some competent post players crean will never win in the Big 10. i for one am starting to run out of patience…

  • http://www.trinityoaklabs.com Hoosiergirl

    THE GOOD: Much better game played tonight, for once we stayed with them(for the most part) and didn't give up on it! I hope TC gives some bonus's in practice for all them charges drawn, haven't seen that many in one game for a long time it seems.

    THE BAD: Dribbled around enough in this game for all of the next games'.

    btw, who is the PTC?

  • http://www.prinsportsblog.com BGleas

    You can't say they didn't play hard or didn't come ready to play tonight. MSU is just that much better right now.

  • choosier

    IU is undersized, can't shoot and the players aren't capable of running a motion offense that will work hard for good looks at the rim. This team needs legit BT quality 4s and 5s. Why is Crean chasing point guards and wing players? These guys hit the wall a month ago and the BT coaches figured out the formula against this team the first week of January.

  • Kelin Blab

    at every position, MSU was bigger and strong. On numerous occassions I saw IU players unable to get around screens or fight through them, not being strong enough to block guys out, and being held off in the post by ONE arm! And folks that is your ballgame…..

  • dougy

    What is this team good at? need an identity offensively. disgusting.

  • HoosierSmitty

    I was much more pleased with this effort. Even though I never really had much to cheer for (aside from winning the team – hey we won something right?) I wasn't terribly disappointed with this effort. The Hoosiers didn't play particularly well, but still hung in there against a much better team.

    We didn't give up and we fought hard the entire night. Even though we struggled offensively, we had several guys get looks and make some moves. I was pretty pleased with the effort tonight and hope we can use the positives from this performance to carry us to another win or two before the end of the season.

    We need to hang on to the guys we have….stay with us Hoosiers….players and fans!

  • HoosierSmitty

    ESPN Mobile Web is amazingly accurate….

    For example, how did Maurice Creek get a rebound?

  • BaseballBuc

    Something doesn't make sense. We had an awful team last year and we only lost to MSU by 4 at home. They went to the championship game. This year we have a better team, and they have a worse team, and we get killed. That right there shows you how hard last years team played and competed night in and night out. If we play like that this year, we might not be having this discussion. I just don't see why these kids aren't buying into what Crean is selling.

  • kentuckyhoosier

    Feel better ? ? Really ?About what ? That they played with effort ? Really , is that what we have to appluad now , EFFORT ? Well i guess thats what everyone does now , since crean the general applauds everything good or bad that they do , why dont we all .I just saw many other ways that this team gets beat . We should all fell lucky , DAMN LUCKY , that it was'nt 28 again ! Yes we hit free throws , and thats great , but we are still the worst in the conference at the stripe ! And that alone is why it was 14 not 28 . So do I feel better about a stagnant offense that has 10+ min scoring droughts as I watch coach clap em up …….NO I DON,T FEEL BETTER AT ALL !!!!!!!!!!

  • Mark

    I didn't know it was possible for an injured player to have a better stat line then Tijan

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1790604551 facebook-1790604551

    Yeah what do u want Crean to do? He has to encourage them, if he yells and screams at them they will get so discouraged it wouldn't be any better! With a young team you coach them, not yell at every mistake they make!

  • kentuckyhoosier

    I understand , and im not saying “yell and scream ” , but show some since of urgency ! hey at this point they are sophs , cant baby them and keep them young forever .

  • kentuckyhoosier

    lol , i have better stats than tijon , they arent negative stats

  • Guest

    i would agree that this wasn’t a knock on hulls if after every single game jerry wasnt pointing him out. all im saying is that he is basing what he says on what he saw in a stat box not what he actually saw. i agree with the type of players we have, this weave doesn’t work and the offensive scheme deserves questioning. However, I just wanted to point out that he singles jordan out every single game (usually with others) and if he was going to use the box score well i would to.

  • Druid

    In the second half, (I think) a ball flew out of bounds and Maurice caught it. I guess they gave him a rebounding stat for that.

  • marsh21

    This team has two reliable offensive producers at best and one is a soph the other a fresh so please everyone relax. Out matched at every position and out sized and not enough raw talent yes, again everyone please understand.

    Elston Comments – I read a lot of comments about everyone wanting him to play more no matter what…, This kid has some raw talent and a good basketball body but his issues are mostly mental. He simply cannot play defense, he cannot screen, he cannot block out very well and his offense is without question some of the worst on the team. This kid sometimes just falls down when trying to make a move.. Crean doesn't play him because he makes so many mistakes.

    If Elston transfers be happy!

    He is not alone as I could give similar comments to others.

    Gents this rebuilding process is a long term issue, 5+ years, before we see top level talent and possibilities. Everyone on this team besides the current freshman were just a last minute get to have a team on the floor!

    IU fans should be smarter than this and not expect too much for some time!!! Yes, I know ITS INDIANA and I feel the same way but reality is reality.

  • Will

    Crean does seek out point guards and this is consistent with his Marquette days. Forget about developing an inside force because in all of his days at MU he had l legit inside force, Robert Jackson in 02. Otherwise he had continuous inside non productive projects. A five guard offense will be interesting.

  • JerryCT

    I did not see the game so I have no right to comment about the game HOWEVER I notice Hulls with “0″ assists in 30 minutes………….that's right ,………0…..and this is his greatest skill.

    I think the case is mounting that coach needs to change his offensive scheme to better fit these players.

  • walton

    Tijon and Bawa don’t take up scholarship spots do they? I have a hard time figuring out why these guys were brought in. I understand they are big guys, but come on. If IU doesn’t have any bigs coming in with a little bit more basketball iq and/or coordination they will be in trouble for a while.

  • Guest

    god you and your thing against Hulls is really annoying, every game hulls lacks this and that. here is a number for you, 5….that's right….5. 5 assists the whole game by the team. that includes 2 from rivers to go along with 3 turnovers, 4 points. PG comparison tells me that rivers had 1 more assist than hulls with two more turnovers and jordan put one more point than him. And assists go to the person who makes the immediate pass setting up the score, it doesn't show the person who set up the play and got the ball moving. Youre probably wondering why your boy dumes only got 17 minutes…its cuz his awesome d in the first half was actually made by grabbing anything he could and picking up 3 immediate fouls early and had to sit the rest of the half. You would know this if you saw the game. A lot of things don't show up in the stat column and we know youre a get hulls out of the game but look at everything before you actually point out one kids problem consistently without calling everyone else out. Cuz i promise hulls isnt the only one who played bad last night.

  • ldiu

    I sure don't understand why Elston doesn't get more quality playing time, either. We'll not beat anyone as long as 40% of our lineup cannot score. Rivers and Pritchard were 2-9 and both makes were a layup and meaningless dunk in the final seconds. I would not play Rivers one second as he is such a liability. If we are going to get beat (and we are) we might as well get beat with freshman and try and build for the future.

  • Bryan

    I don't think this was a knock on Hulls, I think Jerry is wondering how the offense IU currently runs generates so little offensive movement that a kid like Hulls, with decent passing skills, can play 3/4 of a game and never generate an assist.

    This came up during the live chat last night, and it does beg the further examination – which approach is better for a start-up project like IU has. Do you play the style you want to ultimately want to play, and live with the fact that your personnel won't match it for some time, or do you run a different offense, which may suit your current players better, but may not be as attractive to the type of player you need long term, and will delay the point that you have to scrap everything your returning players know in favor of the new system?

    Clearly, we know which approach Coach Crean chose for this season. He tried to use the offense he wants to play, pushing pace and favoring a transition game, over the slower pace IU played at last season, with more set plays. Obviously, the results have been bumpy this season, and not everyone from last year's team has been suited for it.

    It's frustrating for fans, because you can easily try to read between the lines, and claim that the other choice would have led to a few more wins, it's hard to really say if the team would have won or lost taking the other approach. This is still a team that has a hard time knocking down free throws when a game is tight, and had ball control problems running last year's offense. Also, no offensive scheme can make up for the fact that IU can't seem to close out on shooters, because they have to overcommit to keep teams from running a layup line against them.

  • dphattybrown

    What everyone needs to step back and understand is how young this team is and what that means. Everyone uses the same excuse “the team is just too young”, but what does that mean? If you have any clue as to what kind of coach Tom Crean is you would understand what the true meaning of having a “young” team with no veterans. No i am not talking about guys that are immature or guys that run out of gas as the season progresses. I am talking about understanding the game and the system within your program.
    Last years team ran maybe 1/20th of the playbook Crean has to offer and there are 4 players from last years team who REALLY got playing time and can help the coach “teach” these products to the new class. It is obvious to me that TC has tought this group a very select amount of sets to work from, and until they perfect that he is not going to add any more (which i respect greatly). Think about what you have seen this year on defense , Man, 2-3 zone and the 1-3-1 which was added for the Northwestern game and executed very poorly. TC ran a multitude of sets while at Marquette and we should see some much better play in the coming 2 seasons.
    What we as fans need to do is understand the situation and be patient with it. TC could have likely coached this team to a .500 season doing things the WRONG way, but getting these kids to understand the system will only help future classes and that is the RIGHT way even if you have to sacrifice some victories.

  • hoooooosier

    I understand the frustration that comes with a lack of skilled players on the block, but it's not that easy to get one of those guys. Talented youngsters who are taller than 6'8'' are few and far between, and everybody out there is recruiting them. The days of IU being able to take their pick of high schoolers is over, particularly in Indiana where Painter has made significant progress is getting in-state talent and Louisville, Ohio State and N.C. are sniping our best talent. Crean has to get the guys that he can get, and it's just the truth that there's a wider pool of talent at the guard and forwards positions than there is down low. And going to the J.C. ranks to pick up a big sounds great, but more often than not you're gonna end up with a Jobe-type situation. There are gaps all over the IU roster (Mo Creek and Watford the only notable exceptions), and TC has to fill them all the best he can.

  • tg1438

    My concern right now is how the offense creates no easy baskets. VJ3 was running around crazily last night off of screen after screen, but a combination of him not using the screens all the time, the screeners not setting effective screens because they lack strength, and not getting the ball to him on time makes him work extra hard to get his baskets. It also hurts that TP and Rivers are no threat at all to score the basketball. Then at times you have both of them on the floor with Moore, who is another threat to not score. I would love to see a lineup of Hulls, Dumes, VJ3, Watford, and either Elston or Capo (just because he will at least shoot it if he's open) to try and give the team a spark offensively at times. I'm not saying this would fix anything, but at least you'd have to guard the 5 guys on the floor. I just would like to see easy baskets in the paint, either by great ball movement, good screens or cuts, or penetration opened up by the other two things. Get your posts an easy layup because the defense has had to rotate quickly and is out of position or has a mismatch because a weakside guard dropped in on a post player. Sorry, starting to beg a bit now!!

  • IUDan

    Great perspective – i agree – I'm not sure we're going to get where we want to be by adapting the offense for one year, and then changing it next year, or whenever Crean gets “his” type of players. I'd rather take some lumps this year, but have those guys in a position to really learn the offense and execute/teach it over the next two+.

  • marsh21

    This team has two reliable offensive producers at best and one is a soph the other a fresh so please everyone relax. Out matched at every position and out sized and not enough raw talent yes, again everyone please understand.

    Elston Comments – I read a lot of comments about everyone wanting him to play more no matter what…, This kid has some raw talent and a good basketball body but his issues are mostly mental. He simply cannot play defense, he cannot screen, he cannot block out very well and his offense is without question some of the worst on the team. This kid sometimes just falls down when trying to make a move.. Crean doesn't play him because he makes so many mistakes.

    If Elston transfers be happy!

    He is not alone as I could give similar comments to others.

    Gents this rebuilding process is a long term issue, 5+ years, before we see top level talent and possibilities. Everyone on this team besides the current freshman were just a last minute get to have a team on the floor!

    IU fans should be smarter than this and not expect too much for some time!!! Yes, I know ITS INDIANA and I feel the same way but reality is reality.

  • deedubbadoo

    My question is, when does Tom Pritchard fall out of the starting lineup? I mean he played 8 more minutes than Elston and 5 more minutes than Bobby Cappuccino, and had similar if not lower production. Face facts, the kid is just not that good. Jeremiah Rivers is the worst coaches' son I have ever seen. How can your father be Doc Rivers and you can't shoot free throws or anything outside of 8 feet from the bucket? TC needs to let Elston, Jones, Watford, and Hulls run together, these guys need time to build chemistry. I still support this team and TC to the fullest but can't help but think what could of been, if we had Creek and Matt “Freakin” Roth able to play. Truth of the matter is, it is not losses like this that upset me, this is a top flight team. 17 point losses to Northwestern after back to back nail-biters with Illinois and Purdue, that is what hurts the most. You never know who is going to show except VJ3, kid shows up every night and works hard, knowing that he is going to be the focus of every team's defense.

    I hate to say it, but these scoring droughts and the constant dribbling remind me of that old Mike Davis offense, dribble around for 30 seconds, then hoist up a 23 footer. This year is over, let's at least start the Bawa experience, anything to shake up this stagnant play of late.

  • tberry

    YES BUT…The excuses are beginning to sound a lot like IU Football!!!

  • aceman07

    I agree that they came out and played hard tonight! I also saw some things last night that were a little encouraging including the hustle and effort of Tom Pritchard. I still contend that once Pritchard has other big men around him he will be a consistent player and contributor. As for the matter I thought that both Capo and Elston again showed some things tonight that lead me to believe that they are going to be solid contributors in the future as well. I just wish CTC would leave Elston on the floor for more than two minutes and I wish he'd put Elston, Pritchard, and Watford on the floor at the same time! I think it would make Watford better!

  • aceman07

    I've noticed some negativity towards Hulls from him as well. He must be from a school that B South beat last year or something. Here' what Jerry missed. Hulls keyed the run at the beginning of the game that kept this thing from becoming a complete blowout early! Furthermore, he made two very nice passes in the first half during their run as well. One resulted in a foul and the other was a kick out that just happened to go to Rivers who wouldn't shoot if he was the only player on the floor! Use some basketball IQ and open your eyes to the fact that most good things that happen to this team happen when Jordy Hulls is on the floor because he is the closest thing to a leader that this team has. Jerry must have hated Tom Coverdale when he was young!

  • JerryCT

    Thanks Bryan. You got it exactly. I donot think we are putting Hulls in the best positions to succeed ie when and where he is on the floor………so another way to ask my question is :

    1) should be build offense around transition ie Rivers ……or….
    2) build offense around Hulls ie “mover/blocker” type

    It does not hurt to have both but so far this season I have only seen transition offense except for brief flirtations with the high stack ..mostly run through Elston

  • MillaRed

    Man if I read another “this team is young” post I truly am going to vomit. That comment has been written 500 times this season.

    What does young have to do with your 4th year junior NBA pedigree point guard slinging his 50th pass right to a defender that results in a layup?

    What does it have to do with Dumes jacking up a few more 30 footers with a man in his face?

    What does it have to do with Tijan “I can't stand up Jobe” getting more minutes that Bawa that can help in the future?

    Crean really, really puzzles me sometimes. He needs to yank these guys out when they make these dumb errors. If we're gonna lose let's lose without that kind of BS on the floor. And all of the above are upperclassmen!

    The Hulls comments? Goodness. This kid will make us all very happy before he graduates. I have no doubts there.

    Let's hope Elston transfers? My goodness dude are you a Purdue fan? Get real.

    The team needs Creek back and can only hope a few of our bigs really turn it around next year because poor Tommy Pritchard is just terrible right now. Here's to Bobby C. hitting a few three's a game next year and pulling down 6 boards. There are other times when Moore and Rivers pass up on that wide open 3 and Matt Roth can help in that area too.

  • marcusgresham

    You obviously don't remember Rollie Massimino's son at Villanova. Yikes! I agree that Rivers lack of ability is in pretty much every area (minus defense) that SHOULD be the strength of a coach's son

  • valpohistory

    Elston doesn't play because his defense is terrible. He makes Watford look like DHoward. Rivers is the only person on this team that can play defense consistently. He held Lucas to two points the entire first half, then when Rivers got put on the bench, he rattled off something like 7 points in a row. We're already playing AT LEAST two freshman on the floor at a time, and that doesn't include when we have Bobby or Derek in at 5. That's not how you win, especially since our freshman are so weak and undeveloped skillfully. Show some patience my friend. I'll bet Coach Crean knows more about basketball than you

  • valpohistory

    Michigan State didn't show up last year. Plain and simple

  • valpohistory

    And I have a hard time arguing that State got worse. Three starters returned, including two of their best developing for another year and becoming 1. arguably the top player in the big ten (Lucas) and 2. possibly the best swing man in Raymar Morgan. Then you add in a year of development to Draymond Green, Delvon Roe, and the other guards that they returned, I'd say they are a equal if not much better team than last year.

  • valpohistory

    Then you are going to be VERY frustrated the rest of the year. If they were outclassed athletically, why are you upset? It takes time to develop physically in college basketball, unless your name is John Wall or DeMarcus Cousins. Yeah, they might be a rare exception as they really are only playing with one junior, who is their uncontested leader, and a lot of sophomores, but all of the other freshman making a big impact have TONS of senior and junior leadership around them. We have to develop it, so if you run out of patience this year, take the spring and summer, get over it, then come back with a new vengeance next year, because we WILL be far improved.

  • iurons

    Rebuilding will take longer than most people think. They only have one additional scholarship available over the next two years. While everyone is bashing our bigs, strength and confidence will improve each year and they will be competitive. That being said the lack of size in our recruiting classes the next two years does not allow for any loss of depth due to transfers or injuries. It will take some luck, a lot of hard work and the unexpected development of a couple of our four star recruits into players the caliber of Kalin Lucas, Evan Turner or Moore, Johnson and Hummel ( all 4 star recruits ) to really move up the ladder of the big ten. My main concern though is can we learn to defend one on one and as a team to the point where we can go into each game thinking we have a chance to win. There have only been a handful of games this year that I didn't enjoy watching and hopefully next year there will be fewer.

  • http://www.prinsportsblog.com BGleas

    Agree with your thoughts on Elston and Capo. I just think they should be taking advantage of the fact that we have two bigs, and really three if you include Watford, that can knock down perimeter jumpers. This would open the floor so much for VJIII, Hulls and even Rivers to penetrate. But, we don't seem to utilize this at all. With Elston, I think his confidence is just completely shot.

  • valpohistory

    It's not an excuse? Youth is what kills us? Almost every guard on Michigan State was a junior, and they got to learn under one of the best teachers of the game in Izzo. Their team also went to the final four because three of their starters were two seniors and junior. They have consistency at State. We don't. You can't expect us to be held at the same level of criticism and consistency, YET. Rivers, I agree can make dumb mistakes, but he also is our only viable on the ball defender and ball handler. With a year or so, Hulls will be able to handle it, but currently he can not. Rivers has to play, if not for defensive purposes only. Dumes….I can't really defend the 40 footers or whatever, but when he hits, we play a lot better. Also, at least he plays fearless and isn't afraid to take an open look, even though it may not be the best shot available. Tijan, he only played last night because our bigs were getting just bodied around and Crean got sick of it. Tijan went right in and set a hard screen, granted an offensive foul, but he at least plays with a passion for this game that we rarely see from those on our team who play a lot.As for the Crean pulling players comment, have you seen us the last few games? Who is he going to put in when he pulls them? WE HAVE NO DEPTH. Yank who for who? Dumes already doesn't play a lot of minutes, Tijan plays a minute a game, and Rivers is the only person on our team that can guard the ball so unless you have an answer I don't know about, there is nothing Crean can do. Hulls will develop, as I said earlier, so I agree there. Elston needs to guard somebody. He guards people without just using his arms, he will get his minutes. Right now, he doesn't, so he sits. He is still very talented, so I'm with you on that comment too. Our bigs will put on a TON of muscle this summer and I have confidence they will play with fire and skill when they come back next year. It's also very debatable that Pritchard is playing terrible right now, but I've already picked enough fights on your points so I'll leave it at that. Quick though, Roth may not be playing these high minutes that everyone expects on this forum. He wasn't playing much early in the year, when he was healthy and we were playing poor teams. Hopefully, Matt would be taking Daniel Moore's minutes that he plays currently, but even that would surprise me as Moore at least plays defense, while Matt does not. That's all I have. Be patient though, it will keep your blood pressure down :)

  • walton

    Hulls is not IU's problem! He is a solid player for his position. The problem is there are too many people his size on the team. You need some big people to win consistently in basketball and IU doesn't have any! I don't see IU moving to the top of the big ten until they get a presence inside.

  • walton

    Speaking of Rivers not being a scoring threat – what happened? I seem to remember him being able to get to the rim much more often (kind of an understatement). He seems to not even try any more.

  • MillaRed

    Valpo, you make good points buddy. My point is, Rivers is a 4th year junior, he threw a pass I would expect a 10 year old to make……2 points. He had another earlier in the game. 2 points. (let's not mention his triple-pump Air Jordan reverse layup brick)

    Dumes jacks up a terrible 3, long rebound, fast break, 2 points.

    Tijan enters game, goes low on the pick and roll like a drunk giraffe, wide open 3 pointer….3 points.

    I'm up to 9 easy points here solely based on our upperclassmen. That is plenty enough to lose momentum if not the game. All individual efforts. None of which got pulled from the game.

    We have more problems on this team than youth. Our upperclassmen make horrible plays and they don't seem to be held accountable, at least during the game.

    That's my point. You make many other good points yourself.

  • HoosierSmitty

    Everyone,

    It's hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel when we're only at the beginning.

    Just be thankful as fans we have a solid forum to voice our opinions! Every other blog/post/conversation related to IU is just littered with nonsense.

  • Hoagland

    I will agree here that Elston doesn't play because of his defense, on his first 2 or 3 plays in, he had already surrendered 2 layups. What I won't fully agree with is the Rivers comments. Lucas only scored 2 in the first half, because simply put, he didn't need to do more, they were getting layups at will. If shutting him off is simply forcing him to get assists for layups rather than actually score himself, then yea we shut him down, but he still killed us. This is kind of like Evan Turner didn't have his best game statistically against us, not because we are an amazing defensive team, but because he didn't need to. OSU and MSU didn't need their star point guards to score like normal because everyone else was getting dunks or layups.

  • Indiana_Knight

    Our size certainly isn't optimal, but it isn't bad. We have a lot of good players at 6'9″ and up, they're just young and undersized right now. They need more time in the weight room to help the freshmen (Capo, Watford, and Elston) transition to the physicality of this league in particular. Watford especially will benefit from time in the weight room. Those of you that discount their youth as a factor don't understand how much bigger and stronger juniors and seniors are than freshman who haven't spent as much time around excellent facilities and good strength and conditioning coaches. These guys are literally kids and they are still growing.

    We're not really loaded at the guard position, we're loaded at forward. Next year, we will have great depth at both positions, even if C may be a weak point with Bawa and Pritchard, I think they could both improve.

    Watford is a good basketball player. He has good instincts, terrific length, a high level of skill, shoots well from the line, and will develop the size he needs to play more effectively in the post over time. You'll start to see that next year but he is pretty thin so he should continue to improve that part of his game for as long as he is a Hoosier.

    Creek returns next year. He scored well inside and also shot the ball well from the perimeter.

    Rivers has weaknesses, can play out of control at times, and has trouble converting free throws but that will improve with another offseason. I don't think he'll be a huge offensive threat, but he can become an even stronger player and continue to play good defense.

    Verdell's improvement from last year to this year should hearten some of you guys as to what this very talented freshman class will be able to do this time next year. We're not anywhere near strong enough to bang around with most Big Ten teams, but once we get stronger I think the size and the talent is there. Watford is 6'9″. And he certainly doesn't look like he weighs the 220 he is listed at. Compare him with Elston listed 6'9″, 220, Capo at 6'9″, 238, or Pritchard at 6'9″, 248. Watford has the skill to do a lot once he puts on some weight. Some of his passing needs work, but I really like him to improve in the weight room over the summer.

    This team's predicament is much different than the football team's. Lynch lost his only 4-star recruit in this class. Crean landed several this year and they'll all benefit mightily from going through a Big Ten season and having spent extended time in the strength and conditioning program. Look at the improvement Verdell has made in terms of strength from last year to this year. We have very talented freshman and they'll all return stronger sophomores.

  • MillaRed

    Way to bring us down to Earth Smitty. We all gripe at each other but the cool thing about this site is that we all care about The Hoosiers.

    Hey, if we didn't why bother right?

    Every 3-4 days I choose to sit and watch these kids even though it's like volunteering for a few hours of slow torcher. By the 10 minute mark of the second half I'm pretty numb these days…….

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