Hoosier loss overshadowed by Dumes’ shenanigans

I considered boring you with another AP style recap of IU’s 75-47 loss at Michigan State, but as Devan Dumes was tossed shortly after throwing his third elbow of the game, I quickly changed direction.

I realize it’s a long season and the players are probably frustrated with the losses that are piling up. It’s not easy to come out each game, play hard and know no matter how well you play, you’re probably going to lose. But the behavior from Dumes was flat out unacceptable. I was willing to dismiss his elbow on Craig Moore during the Northwestern game as a lapse in judgment during the heat of battle.

After today, I’m left wondering if Dumes should be punished by either Indiana or the Big Ten. For those of you who missed the game, here’s a blow by blow recap of what went down:

  • 21 seconds into the game, Dumes is whistled for a foul.
  • At the 17:32 mark of the first half, he’s slapped with his second foul and heads to the bench.
  • Re-enters at the 12:44 mark and by the 12:03 mark, he’s whistled for his third foul (offensive).
  • With 16:31 remaining in the second half, a replay shows that Dumes elbowed Michigan State forward Goran Suton in the crotch during transition. The officials reviewed the play and decided to allow him to remain in the game, but ESPN announcers later revealed that they didn’t have access to the one replay that clearly showed the elbow was intentional.
  • At the 2:10 mark, Dumes was hit by an inadvertent elbow by Michigan State forward Tom Herzog and retaliated with an elbow of his own. It was his fifth foul and also a flagrant and Dumes was ejected.

I have no problem with guys competing and playing with an edge. But when you’re throwing unprovoked elbows, especially in the waning moments of a blowout loss, you’ve got all of the elements of a cheap shot. And that’s the last thing Tom Crean needs to have on his hands while trying to rebuild a program that, let’s face it, has lost some credibility with the events that transpired last season. He’s trying to rebuild the privelege of wearing the IU uniform that’s been missing as of late.

So my questions for you, ITH’ers, are as follows: Did you view the elbows as intentional? How, if at all, should Dumes be punished? Thoughts on those questions as well as your reaction to the game are welcome in the comments, boys and girls.

  • silkyslim

    How about a one game suspension and 1000 laps ala 'Coach Carter' movie.
    Does that seem fair enough?

    Maybe he can run the new stadium steps until the cows come home.
    Just please have some kind of consequence to ensure the lesson is clearly learned.

    I am disappointed by this poor choice/behavior for the first time this year which for me has been an interesting & exciting work in progress.

  • Hoosier_Hound

    I would give him a two game suspension and have him run until he's too tired to swing his elbows. I think it should be more than one game for several reasons: he's an upperclassman who should know better, there were three elbows not just one, and this behavior has been building for him and it needs to get nipped. Crean needs to set a precedent here or other players are going to start acting out of frustration, too.

  • Hoosier_Hound

    I would give him a two game suspension and have him run until he's too tired to swing his elbows. I think it should be more than one game for several reasons: he's an upperclassman who should know better, there were three elbows not just one, and this behavior has been building for him and it needs to get nipped. Crean needs to set a precedent here or other players are going to start acting out of frustration, too.

  • tberry

    Obviously the elbows were intentional and that is not INDIANA.

    There needs to be a one game suspension and then not start at least the next game. Coach Crean needs to nip this type of behavior immediately and let all the players know what IU Sportsmanship and decorum is!!!

  • AZdon

    Yeah, it;s been a tough year for the players… but you don't see Jones, Prichard, Taber or the others taking cheap bush-league shots at the other players… frustrated or not. Didn't we have enough of that crap last year with Sampson and the dope smoking, class skipping team?

    I say punish him and include the message that this is his ONLY chance. One more time of anything questionable and he's gone. Indiana basketball is much better than that… and it's certainly bigger than any one player, regardless of whether or not he's a “solid contributor”.

  • Jim

    I'm sorry, but when has there ever been a 5 game suspension for throwing elbows? This is just getting ridiculous. This doesn't “damage” IU's reputation. He played stupid yesterday, and got caught, but this is hardly the first time an IU player has done these things (once again, Dane Fife, etc). Stop overreacting.

  • MikeyD

    too cool…yes i did. suspend dumas for 1 game. that should do the trick. bad judgment but 1 game should do.

  • RIC

    I see Dumas getting to know each and every step in Assembly Hall on a personal basis…I'm sure Coach Crean will deal with it internally, as it should be…Old School like Coach Knight!

  • Kelin Blab

    Give Dumes a game suspension and a solid warning.. no need to go overboard here….

  • Jay

    1 game should be fine. My guess would be that Sutan (Spelling?) was not entirely innocent. It happens in football all the time. MSU plays hard, not dirty, sometimes people lose control, no excuse just a fact.

  • MillaRed

    Pull his scholarship? Kick him off the team? 5 game suspension? I'll remind you folks this kid chose Indiana over Ohio State this year. The fact he walked into this rats nest of a season defines a lot of character. This guy has the potential to be All-Big Ten next season.

    Clearly he needs to chill out and we'll leave that to the coach. There is a certain 1-2 game suspension on the horizon and I would be shocked if we see anything close to this type of behavior in the future.

    To those of you on this blog that follow Purdue, Michigan State, Illinois etc……I personally have never visited one blog following your teams, because frankly I could care less. The fact you are on an INDIANA blog only confirms your infatuation with the program and the 5 banners hanging in the stands. We're all really shocked you think Dumes should receive a harsh punishment.

  • Taskmaster75

    Kicking him off the team is simply an emotional response. The kid still isn't used to Big Ten play and how physical it is. This is his first year in the Big Ten guys, a 1-2 game suspension is fine with me, just something that makes him thin twice.

  • Taskmaster75

    Kicking him off the team is simply an emotional response. The kid still isn't used to Big Ten play and how physical it is. This is his first year in the Big Ten guys, a 1-2 game suspension is fine with me, just something that makes him thin twice.

  • silkyslim

    How about a one game suspension and 1000 laps ala 'Coach Carter' movie.
    Does that seem fair enough?

    Maybe he can run the new stadium steps until the cows come home.
    Just please have some kind of consequence to ensure the lesson is clearly learned.

    I am disappointed by this poor choice/behavior for the first time this year which for me has been an interesting & exciting work in progress.

  • Hoosier_Hound

    I would give him a two game suspension and have him run until he's too tired to swing his elbows. I think it should be more than one game for several reasons: he's an upperclassman who should know better, there were three elbows not just one, and this behavior has been building for him and it needs to get nipped. Crean needs to set a precedent here or other players are going to start acting out of frustration, too.

  • Kelin Blab

    People keep this in mind……..”At least he ain't doing anything Michael Phelps/IU last season style”……

    Now if he had elbowed a PU player….you would not have one negative thread on this post….which is clearly acceptable….

    And I agree Milla….I also think the 'banner' infacuation compounded by the not so dominant season PU is having leads many to this blog…I love it….keep em comin'…don't be surprised your boilers find themselves in a close one with the baby hoosiers this year………

  • Kelin Blab

    People keep this in mind……..”At least he ain't doing anything Michael Phelps/IU last season style”……

    Now if he had elbowed a PU player….you would not have one negative thread on this post….which is clearly acceptable….

    And I agree Milla….I also think the 'banner' infacuation compounded by the not so dominant season PU is having leads many to this blog…I love it….keep em comin'…don't be surprised your boilers find themselves in a close one with the baby hoosiers this year………

  • Phillip

    fyi…..suspended indefinitely

  • Phillip

    fyi…..suspended indefinitely

  • Jay

    1 game should be fine. My guess would be that Sutan (Spelling?) was not entirely innocent. It happens in football all the time. MSU plays hard, not dirty, sometimes people lose control, no excuse just a fact.

  • Taskmaster75

    Kicking him off the team is simply an emotional response. The kid still isn't used to Big Ten play and how physical it is. This is his first year in the Big Ten guys, a 1-2 game suspension is fine with me, just something that makes him thin twice.

  • Kelin Blab

    People keep this in mind……..”At least he ain't doing anything Michael Phelps/IU last season style”……

    Now if he had elbowed a PU player….you would not have one negative thread on this post….which is clearly acceptable….

    And I agree Milla….I also think the 'banner' infacuation compounded by the not so dominant season PU is having leads many to this blog…I love it….keep em comin'…don't be surprised your boilers find themselves in a close one with the baby hoosiers this year………

  • Diary

    the elbow wasn't intentional, thats it …..

  • Phillip

    fyi…..suspended indefinitely

  • silkyslim

    Crean is on top of things. That bodes well for the long term.

    Hoosier_Hound, I liked your comment to run him until he is too tired to swing his elbows.

    The next question is it o.k. to elbow a Purdue player if it helps their IQ scores? ;o)

  • silkyslim

    Crean is on top of things. That bodes well for the long term.

    Hoosier_Hound, I liked your comment to run him until he is too tired to swing his elbows.

    The next question is it o.k. to elbow a Purdue player if it helps their IQ scores? ;o)

  • silkyslim

    Crean is on top of things. That bodes well for the long term.

    Hoosier_Hound, I liked your comment to run him until he is too tired to swing his elbows.

    The next question is it o.k. to elbow a Purdue player if it helps their IQ scores? ;o)

  • BFowler

    I commented back during the NW game that I thought he cheap-shotted Moore from NW. I commented his actions after he hit the big shot against Iowa were actions of a person who wanted/needed the spotlight and could not care less about the team.

    I am from the same part of the world as Mr. Dumes and knew some of his high school coaches, and I heard the same thing from them that is manifest now, his attitude is the only thing keeping him back. I thought a couple of years away and the opportunity to play at IU would give him reason to change, but he keeps displaying the same playground-type behavior that is unacceptable on this stage and especially at this time.

    I do not know what the acceptable punishment ought to be, but he needs to know he is wasting a good opportunity and good talent to act in such a way. I thought the rest of the team did not deserve their efforts to have it tainted by the actions of one player. I thought the first elbow was part of the game, but he was reacting to the way Walton was playing him instead of using his aggressiveness against him. The second was clearly intentional as he had room to run around but chose to engage. The third, was clearly out of frustration, but was completely unneccessary. I would be embarrassed if I were him….I only hope he can learn from it.

  • BFowler

    I commented back during the NW game that I thought he cheap-shotted Moore from NW. I commented his actions after he hit the big shot against Iowa were actions of a person who wanted/needed the spotlight and could not care less about the team.

    I am from the same part of the world as Mr. Dumes and knew some of his high school coaches, and I heard the same thing from them that is manifest now, his attitude is the only thing keeping him back. I thought a couple of years away and the opportunity to play at IU would give him reason to change, but he keeps displaying the same playground-type behavior that is unacceptable on this stage and especially at this time.

    I do not know what the acceptable punishment ought to be, but he needs to know he is wasting a good opportunity and good talent to act in such a way. I thought the rest of the team did not deserve their efforts to have it tainted by the actions of one player. I thought the first elbow was part of the game, but he was reacting to the way Walton was playing him instead of using his aggressiveness against him. The second was clearly intentional as he had room to run around but chose to engage. The third, was clearly out of frustration, but was completely unneccessary. I would be embarrassed if I were him….I only hope he can learn from it.

  • BFowler

    I commented back during the NW game that I thought he cheap-shotted Moore from NW. I commented his actions after he hit the big shot against Iowa were actions of a person who wanted/needed the spotlight and could not care less about the team.

    I am from the same part of the world as Mr. Dumes and knew some of his high school coaches, and I heard the same thing from them that is manifest now, his attitude is the only thing keeping him back. I thought a couple of years away and the opportunity to play at IU would give him reason to change, but he keeps displaying the same playground-type behavior that is unacceptable on this stage and especially at this time.

    I do not know what the acceptable punishment ought to be, but he needs to know he is wasting a good opportunity and good talent to act in such a way. I thought the rest of the team did not deserve their efforts to have it tainted by the actions of one player. I thought the first elbow was part of the game, but he was reacting to the way Walton was playing him instead of using his aggressiveness against him. The second was clearly intentional as he had room to run around but chose to engage. The third, was clearly out of frustration, but was completely unneccessary. I would be embarrassed if I were him….I only hope he can learn from it.

  • JimmyChitwood

    I agree with Taskmaster 75 that people are reacting too radically and emotionally to this situation. And that is the most valid point made by anyone so far. Calling for Dumes to be kicked off the team or suspended for 5 games is an emotional response to what was obviously poor judgment by Dumes.

    And to call Dumes a “thug” is ignorant.

    Yes Dumes let his actions and emotions slip out of control, but it was in the middle of a Big Ten game. And, absolutely none of the readers of this blog know what it is like to go through such a frustrating season like this year's team is. Remember, these are 18-22 year old men we are talking about. It is not like Dumes is skipping class to go smoke weed, or constantly disrespecting or completely ignoring the authority of the interim head coach a la last year.

    Dumes, as with the rest of this year's squad, deserve nothing but our support and respect for caring enough about IU basketball to work their tails off day in and day out, only to see limited short-term results.

    I am sick of sitting in the stands at Assembly Hall and listening to fans and students belittle OUR players.

    I constantly hear our own fans make fun of Kyle Taber for his lack of speed and ability. Kyle Taber may not be the most athletic player. But he tries just as hard as (probably harder than) anyone else out there, and we would be even worse off without him because we are small as it is and Pritchard is often in foul trouble.

    I also hear fans complain every time Pritchard makes a mistake, and often hear people refer to him as a “pussy.” Tom Pritchard may make stupid fouls and fail to finish from time to time. But, he is a freshman who was forced to be our team's sole inside threat from the day he stepped on campus. Not to mention he has the burden of defending and competing on the boards against bigger, stronger, more experienced big men throughout the Big Ten.

    It is time for our fans to stop spending their time criticizing our players and instead spend it supporting them and looking forward to turning the corner and building momentum for the future.

    That said, a 1 or 2 game suspension is probably appropriate for Dumes.

  • JimmyChitwood

    I agree with Taskmaster 75 that people are reacting too radically and emotionally to this situation. And that is the most valid point made by anyone so far. Calling for Dumes to be kicked off the team or suspended for 5 games is an emotional response to what was obviously poor judgment by Dumes.

    And to call Dumes a “thug” is ignorant.

    Yes Dumes let his actions and emotions slip out of control, but it was in the middle of a Big Ten game. And, absolutely none of the readers of this blog know what it is like to go through such a frustrating season like this year's team is. Remember, these are 18-22 year old men we are talking about. It is not like Dumes is skipping class to go smoke weed, or constantly disrespecting or completely ignoring the authority of the interim head coach a la last year.

    Dumes, as with the rest of this year's squad, deserve nothing but our support and respect for caring enough about IU basketball to work their tails off day in and day out, only to see limited short-term results.

    I am sick of sitting in the stands at Assembly Hall and listening to fans and students belittle OUR players.

    I constantly hear our own fans make fun of Kyle Taber for his lack of speed and ability. Kyle Taber may not be the most athletic player. But he tries just as hard as (probably harder than) anyone else out there, and we would be even worse off without him because we are small as it is and Pritchard is often in foul trouble.

    I also hear fans complain every time Pritchard makes a mistake, and often hear people refer to him as a “pussy.” Tom Pritchard may make stupid fouls and fail to finish from time to time. But, he is a freshman who was forced to be our team's sole inside threat from the day he stepped on campus. Not to mention he has the burden of defending and competing on the boards against bigger, stronger, more experienced big men throughout the Big Ten.

    It is time for our fans to stop spending their time criticizing our players and instead spend it supporting them and looking forward to turning the corner and building momentum for the future.

    That said, a 1 or 2 game suspension is probably appropriate for Dumes.

  • JimmyChitwood

    I agree with Taskmaster 75 that people are reacting too radically and emotionally to this situation. And that is the most valid point made by anyone so far. Calling for Dumes to be kicked off the team or suspended for 5 games is an emotional response to what was obviously poor judgment by Dumes.

    And to call Dumes a “thug” is ignorant.

    Yes Dumes let his actions and emotions slip out of control, but it was in the middle of a Big Ten game. And, absolutely none of the readers of this blog know what it is like to go through such a frustrating season like this year's team is. Remember, these are 18-22 year old men we are talking about. It is not like Dumes is skipping class to go smoke weed, or constantly disrespecting or completely ignoring the authority of the interim head coach a la last year.

    Dumes, as with the rest of this year's squad, deserve nothing but our support and respect for caring enough about IU basketball to work their tails off day in and day out, only to see limited short-term results.

    I am sick of sitting in the stands at Assembly Hall and listening to fans and students belittle OUR players.

    I constantly hear our own fans make fun of Kyle Taber for his lack of speed and ability. Kyle Taber may not be the most athletic player. But he tries just as hard as (probably harder than) anyone else out there, and we would be even worse off without him because we are small as it is and Pritchard is often in foul trouble.

    I also hear fans complain every time Pritchard makes a mistake, and often hear people refer to him as a “pussy.” Tom Pritchard may make stupid fouls and fail to finish from time to time. But, he is a freshman who was forced to be our team's sole inside threat from the day he stepped on campus. Not to mention he has the burden of defending and competing on the boards against bigger, stronger, more experienced big men throughout the Big Ten.

    It is time for our fans to stop spending their time criticizing our players and instead spend it supporting them and looking forward to turning the corner and building momentum for the future.

    That said, a 1 or 2 game suspension is probably appropriate for Dumes.

  • smokey in Florida

    I agree wholeheartedly! Remember a few years ago how dirty Illinois played? I could not stand that team because of that. We had a man named Marco also that played dirty and I quit watching the games. There is no place for it at Indiana, get rid of him before the problem gets worse. You can't change who a person is by giving a suspension.

  • smokey in Florida

    I agree wholeheartedly! Remember a few years ago how dirty Illinois played? I could not stand that team because of that. We had a man named Marco also that played dirty and I quit watching the games. There is no place for it at Indiana, get rid of him before the problem gets worse. You can't change who a person is by giving a suspension.

  • smokey in Florida

    I agree wholeheartedly! Remember a few years ago how dirty Illinois played? I could not stand that team because of that. We had a man named Marco also that played dirty and I quit watching the games. There is no place for it at Indiana, get rid of him before the problem gets worse. You can't change who a person is by giving a suspension.

  • smokey in Florida

    I agree wholeheartedly! Remember a few years ago how dirty Illinois played? I could not stand that team because of that. We had a man named Marco also that played dirty and I quit watching the games. There is no place for it at Indiana, get rid of him before the problem gets worse. You can't change who a person is by giving a suspension.

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